Elections

Off topic, but don't go too far overboard - after all, we are watching...heh.
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Elections

Postby magus » Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:11 am

As a casual (and thankfully far-removed) observer I am fascinated by the American Elections and the whole Trump vs Clinton thing- I try to stay as apolitical as possible, but I suppose if anything I lean to the left. I'm really curious to see whose allegiance lies where over this- I avoid the news that we get in Europe, but inevitably I see some stuff and as far as our press tells us Trump is a lunatic racist homophobe bigot (I think that's everything)- but the polls still suggest it's very close and either could still win. Now, I realise that with any political event there will be a degree of mud-slinging and defamation, but it seems like Trump is still doing ok despite behaving very poorly.

I don't want an argument, or a rant about your political views- I'm just curious to know what it's like for you guys in your country at a time where the whole world is watching you elect someone who could genuinely have a massive impact on the state of the whole planet. I don't judge anybody by their political persuasion, or religious beliefs- I think it's interesting to find people who you like and have a connection with who have massively differing political affiliations- if everybody thought the same the world would be very dull.

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Re: Elections

Postby Major Meanie » Mon Nov 07, 2016 2:45 pm

Penciling in Ed Snowden

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Re: Elections

Postby EurO » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:44 am

Sure Magus, good question. As someone who holds both Canadian and American citizenship and has lived in Europe, the middle east, and Korea, I am also looking at this election as something unprecedented in American history. Of course, there have been times in the long past where two scoundrels were running for prez, but that was before the media ran the world, and everyone knew everything. So, as a fellow former "apolitical" person, I am going to the polls tomorrow to vote for Trump. Why? It's hard to answer because both of them are terrible candidates. We lament Ben Carson, and Mike Huckabee and maybe even Bernie Sanders, but they all fell by the wayside, and a vote for anyone other than Trump or Hillary is a null vote. So.... I vote for Trump because Hillary should be in jail. Anyone else who has hidden and falsified classified government information while serving on executive staff, as well as launder "material gifts" in the form of huge sums of money through her foundation, plus hire thugs to start riots at her opponent's rallies (see: 1800's)... should not be eligible to run for the president of the United States. Having said that, if America votes in Hillary tomorrow, then I believe that that will officially signify the end of the United States being a superpower - a major player in global industry - and the demise of what America has based it's identity on for so long: patriotism. What will it mean to be American? Hillary's motto is "stronger together", but for all intents and purposes, quite the opposite will unfold.

God bless the United States of America, because God knows all who will be leaders, and appoints them according to His work. It for us to discern, which I feel is being faded out into oblivion...

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Re: Elections

Postby Hayling » Wed Nov 09, 2016 6:33 pm

You could always 'write in' (in quote) or do like the late "George Carlin" did.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIraCchPDhk

Stay home and masturbate.

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Re: Elections

Postby magus » Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:03 am

I love George Carlin.

Euro, thanks for your insight- we get such a distorted view of events from our press, as I'm sure you do- but being over here it feels even further removed. It's encouraging to hear that if Clinton had got in it would/could have been an awful lot worse. I'm interested in what you mean by

" if America votes in Hillary tomorrow, then I believe that that will officially signify the end of the United States being a superpower - a major player in global industry - and the demise of what America has based it's identity on for so long: patriotism. What will it mean to be American? Hillary's motto is "stronger together", but for all intents and purposes, quite the opposite will unfold"

What would she do differently that would affect the Superpower status? What do you mean specifically by Patriotism? I know its definition, but how would she be less Patriotic than Trump- I find his comments to be pretty unpatriotic when you think of the way America has been shaped by it's multi-culturalism. Are we talking about willingless to go to war? :ar15:

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Re: Elections

Postby EurO » Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:52 pm

Well, in my usage of "patriotism", I don't mean just national loyalty, which is more of the dictionary definition. What I mean is, a connection with the identity of the country, based on who founded it, and what that founding was cemented from. For instance, America was built on a "by the people, and for the people" ideology. The Statue Of Liberty says, "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses, yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore, send these, the homeless, tempest tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door". Does this mean 'we receive all terrible citizens from other countries, so that we can bestow upon them freedom and gold'? Maybe then, but times have changed. Patriotism, which was the sauce in the melting pot that became America, was based on freedom, individuality, unity, and strength. Now, we have red light cameras, mosques at the bottom floor of the Freedom Tower, ultimate division among races, ethnicities and cultures that make up the majority, and a bunch of people who make a living on being weak (all addressed respectively, hah). I guess I am rambling, but anyone who is a red-blooded American is no longer shouting out for the Statue Of Liberty's demands. He is not loving the fact that ethnic groups founded thousands of miles away are standing in the doorways to stores and not moving simply because they don't want to. Patriotism is based on loyalty, yes, but loyalty to what?
Not to a willingness to go to war, as you say. Hillary supported themes that were a complete opposite to what the founding fathers would have employed - hence a disconnect from 'American' patriotism. It's like defining the word 'red' without using any words that refer to color. 'Freedom' and especially the American version of it, is becoming more and more difficult.

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Re: Elections

Postby magus » Fri Nov 11, 2016 8:53 am

Very interesting (understatement). The ethnic groups thing is a tricky point for me- and maybe that's because we have an awful lot of ethnic minorities over here, so much so that they really aren't a minority- but I certainly feel that they are British. Their parents lived and worked here, they were born here- so to me their religious beliefs, as long as they don't start infringing on other people's way of life, are irrelevant- and I feel we have to think like that, because the alternative is segregation, judging fellow humans by their choices of beliefs, which to me is not the right path for a world that is getting more and more diffuse, more different beliefs living alongside each other.

It sounds like there's a lot of tension there- is it created by something else? Economic unhappiness? It just seems strange in a vast country full of so many different ethnicities that there wouldn't be more of an ethos of "getting along". Maybe? I have no idea, as you may have guessed from these ramblings.

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Re: Elections

Postby EurO » Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:46 pm

You could do a study on Sociology that has theories on how one culture 'moves in' to another culture's land or territory, and, over time, eradicates the first culture without it even knowing it. There is a dynamic, but slow-and-steady process to this. For instance, if you look at the most common face in the world, it is of a 25-year-old Chinese male. If China were to NOT have had birth regulations for the past few decades, how many people would there be there? And then, those people have to live somewhere, and do something. If they can't do it in China (which, if those numbers were real, they couldn't), then they would move to other countries. Over time, just by sheer numbers, they could change Australia from a Caucasian-founded Commonwealth country to a Caucasian-founded Commonwealth country that has none of them anymore. Just Chinese people.
So, as I continue to ramble, if the minorities become the majority, what do the minorities now stand for? If the only answer is "social variation" and "multiculturalism", then the reason for having a well-defined culture to begin with 3000 years ago was actually pointless. From that standpoint, it was inevitable that whoever had the highest birthrate would dominate the globe.
Does Britain have a very tolerant social view on multiculturalism and immigration? Like telling a little white lie, if you allow just the tiniest of examples of something destructive, eventually that little lie will expand a bit more and more until it becomes the norm. The destructive reigns were the constructive was founded.
The tension is based more on lack of balance. 1% of the population own 99% of the resources. The people who do all the work get paid nothing while the people who don't do any work get paid everything. The people who don't want to work get all the resources, and the ones who can work live paycheck-to-paycheck. If you look at the history of the US, there never really has been much of a 'getting along' stance. From the American Indian, to the Irish and Italian immigrants who did all the crap work, to sending all our money and work to China, to trying to police the world and not get paid for it, and then for the internal strife of people who are ignorant to so many things but all band together to form one ignorant voice... leads to a possible revolution.

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Re: Elections

Postby AndrewTassani » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:39 am

I'm glad to have joined the most popular gaming network. Thanks a lot for accepting me! We are here to talk about an American identity which is the main topic of the current week: Image 

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Re: Elections

Postby EurO » Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:24 pm

Nice pic! So what about American identity would you like to discuss?

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