real life apache attack

by **Jeffro** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:43 pm

One thing i do agree with chacal is that we have a sense of selfish nationalism and patriotism...

I just took a look at it again and all I have to say is holy shit!

Dismemberment everywhere!

My mouth was open after actually paying attention to the details of the video! :eek:

by **Dakana** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:47 pm

No need for profanity there... calm down

I saw that on ABC when it aired... pretty sick. The pilots knew it was an RPG and that's why they opened fire. The guy crawling on the ground was shot so that he didn't die from blood loss or some agonizing thing like that.

When they first shoot - you can see the guy's leg or arm go flying >.<

by **Rand0m** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:50 pm

Originally posted by Jeffro
One thing i do agree with chacal is that we have a sense of selfish nationalism and patriotism...

I just took a look at it again and all I have to say is holy shit!

Dismemberment everywhere!

My mouth was open after actually paying attention to the details of the video!

Wow second time around isnt fun at all. I hadnt realized how bad it was first time around.

by **Bagginses** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:58 pm

My opinion here is that the issue of the Apache crew firing or not pales in comparison to the fact that ABC actually considers this newsworthy. In my opinion, "news" is defined as information and/or footage that a) helps me be a more intelligent person, b) provides advice that I can use in the future, or c) provides me with credible information that I can use to either argue for or against an issue.

Now I'm just failing to see how this footage fits into any of those categories because I'm certainly not seeing it. I don't need a video to show me that a .30 mm cannon is going to rip me apart, or that if an Apache is hovering outside my house I should make sure I don't go carrying around my PVC-pipe potato cannon in plain view.

As far as helping to sway opinions go, this definitely has not done a damn thing, because if you supported the war, you probably found the video fascinating, enlightening, or "awesome." Alternatively, if you opposed it, you found it tasteless, unnecessary, and "horrible." So it for sure did not change any opinions.

This was just a stupid, and asinine way for ABC to drag in some more viewers so that they can be considered a more "reliable, credible, and exclusive" news force, in the hope that advertisers will be more willing to fork over the money. It's funny, I bet Peter Jennings could make a pile of dog shit sound like it's credible and important news.

-Bagginses

by **Jeffro** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:05 pm

Originally posted by Bagginses

I bet Peter Jennings could make a pile of dog shit sound like it's credible and important news.

-Bagginses

by **Casus** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:25 pm

War is hell, get over it.

What really makes this sick is that the news media treat it like it's a big video game, that is the sad part.

Why? Because WE as consumers want it, and cannot get enough of it.

Think about where the REAL problems exist here.

We all watched the video dozens of times, and sent it to everyone who probably watched it dozens of times, and sent it to another dozen folks, and so on and so on and so on.

Casus

by **smithpa68** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:27 pm

Yeah. I agree Bagginses. Well said.

by **Major SONAR** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:29 pm

By Chacal:

Those guys in the Apache are my heroes, they deserve a medal. Firing at wounded people crawling on the ground is such a great feat. Needs courage. Hail to the gallant US troops.

Yep. Those guys are my heroes too. Just like every other American G.I. over in Iraq and Afganistan. Keep up the good work guys.

It's unfortunate our neighbors to the north are so liberal. It would be nice if they supported our efforts to stop terrorism and genocide.

I'm not for senseless killing, but if our soldiers are getting killed, then I'm all for beating the enemy by being proactive. We (Americans) are not the bad guys, contrary to what some might think. IMHO it will be a long time before our troops leave Iraq, but I believe in the end the Iraqi people will be much better off than they were under Saddam.

If you look at history, WW II in particular, you will see we managed to create democracies in BOTH Germany and Japan. Democracies which still stand today, over 60 years later. I can only hope that the outcome will be the same in Iraq sometime in the future.

Chacal... nothing personal bud. We just have a difference in opinion.

by **LeVar Burton** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:49 pm

I understand how Chacal and Capriccio get pissed, especially after people respond with lines like "that was awesome." However, we get pissed every time people respond with sarcasm like "he deserves a medal." Do we have an enormous advantage? Yes. Do we deserve to be called cowards and bullies because of it? No.

by **CapriccioSCOURG** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 9:10 pm

I however, did not reply with sarcasm.

I have nothing against the men who were doing their job. They are trained to not let emotions get in the way of what they are there to do. It's not the men, or the idealism of it all that got me, it was the faceless phantom in the night that just killed these men. It is impressive, no doubt. But it's a little scary too, which is what I meant by my comment on it being insane.

I was mostly upset that people found it "awesome" that they had just watched people die. We're supposed to care about all life, not just American or Canadian or Iraqi people. Because in the end they are all people. They could be Nazis or terrorists or any other "enemy" of America, but no one can pretend to know everything that's influenced them to where they are or why they hate the US occupation of their country. Sure, they could be truely evil people who get there kinkies killing Coalition troops and innocents with roadside bomb, but they could just have easily been brainwashed into thinking that the Americans were in their country to control their government, make them all infertile. Ignorance is the problem here, on both sides.

Even if that was Hitler, Nero, and Saddam being shot down in the video I still couldn't ever get over myself thinking it was "awesome" to see a living being explode.

What sucks is that there is no clear cut answer to situations like this. Which is why war has never gone away, and probably never will. It's just annyoing, but I have to deal with that myself. I mean no offense, but I felt I should clear that up.

Call me un-American. Call me a wacko liberal. But please, don't hate.

by **SGT DEVILDOG** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:11 pm

We Americans are at war like it or not, support it or not. "War IS HELL" That is not some made up qoute that is brought out when ever one is fought. The only ones who know that for sure are the ones who have fought in one, and have held their buddy as he bleeds out. It is easy to condem people if you have never been in this unforunate postion.

The question is....Should have the Apache pilot let that unknown object (Missile Launcher) with a crew sit there until the next black Hawk flew over and 16 more soldiers that were on their way home to America instead get to the Morgue. I think not. What we see in that 1.06 min is the end result of a lengthy recon I am sure of this, because I have had some experience with this sort of thing on the control side of things. I am sure you did not see the wepon being set up. It takes at least 5-10 min to get a green light. to take a target out. Also, their was no hurry because the enemy obviously had no idea the Apache was there. If that Apache did let that Anti-air missile sit and a black hawk did get shot down all we would be hearing is why didn't that Apache save our troops. I am sorry you cant have it both ways. Either they kill us or we kill them. I am truly glad that we do not have a LIB in power right now. Everytime I hear a liberal complain about causalties in Iraq I wish they would be forced to watch those 100's people jump out the towers to their deaths, or listen to the 911 calls that were being made that day. What about the whole middle east danceing in the street when they saw innocent non military people dying. Have we forgotten so soon?

We are at war and if its a choice between 3 Iraqies or a Coalition chopper. Guess what I choose. Yes those pilots are heros and Damn straight they deserve a metal, because they saved American/ British lives. We did not start this War on Terror, but you can bet your ass we will finish it.

For those of you who posted inflamitory posts or name calling posts :mad:

I will speak with you privately through either TS or a PM

by **Evan** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:18 pm

Now now guys. Please don't turn this into a flame war.

by **Sewer-Urchin** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:32 pm

Originally posted by Casus
War is hell, get over it.

What really makes this sick is that the news media treat it like it's a big video game, that is the sad part.

Why? Because WE as consumers want it, and cannot get enough of it.

Think about where the REAL problems exist here.

We all watched the video dozens of times, and sent it to everyone who probably watched it dozens of times, and sent it to another dozen folks, and so on and so on and so on.

Casus

Casus is absolutely right. We de-value suffering and death. I teach 8th graders, and it is frightening to think how much they would enjoy that video. They hear about violence on the news, listen to it in their songs and play it on the PS2 and XBbox. Most of us can tell the difference between virtual and real, but I'm afraid the next generation might be lacking that ability. Bagginsess is also right, the media loves a video like that because of the shock value. It's very easy when watching it to forget that it really happend.

by **CapriccioSCOURG** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 11:02 pm

Exactly.

I don't know if it's really that new though. It just hasn't had the mediums we have today.

by **Mugzy** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 11:10 pm

Thats a HUGE problem with the US. Violence is just fine, while nudity/sex is something that has to be hidden.

I have to admit that I did not even watch this video before posting it, and now that I have seen it, I don't think I would have posted it.

If this was a video of IRAQ soldiers killing Americans, I think we would all be pissed and disgusted.

real life apache attack

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